What the heck is going on with the forums?

[Dennis]

I know I'm probably going to step on somebody's foot, but please slow down.

Change is not always good, and it really feels like someone decided to change everything about the forums, even stuff that shouldn't be changed. It feels like one person pulls all the strings;

1. Get an idea
2. Think "that's a good idea"
3. Implement this idea on the forums

It doesn't feel like any of the ideas are discussed with anyone else, and it feels like everything is very rushed. All suggested ideas has been implemented without any hesitation.

To examples:

First:

While I'm generally happy that a Downloads section has been added, it again feels rushed.

 

Quote

We've now disabled the ability to attach files other then pictures & video's inside the forums!

Why? There are tons of reasons why I would need to upload a .cfg, a .txt or a .log file.

Second:

A few days ago, a post was made suggesting community donations to pay for licenses for the forum. After I made some criticism to this, the entire thread was deleted. That really is not the way the forums should work. Threads shouldn't just get deleted because they're not relevant/useful anymore. Also, something so relevant as asking an already paying community for donations really should be discussed before asking the community how they feel about this.

[Alexr03]

I agree, this forum does just feel rushed out.

While I do appreciate that stuff is changing to be modern. (I was going through the web archive looking at the TCAdmin site & forums, they had not changed much/at all from 2006/7 till now and for that I appreciate that changes are finally happening) 

It was installed on the 21st and went live on the 24th. The features that the community wanted didn't come until after the forum was publicly released. It probably would of been better for them to be installed, tested, validated then deployed here to the forum before any changes were made.

How about any testers? You have a whole community here that want to help change TCAdmin for the better, wherever that be create themes/plugins/configs for you, help test and develop new features like the forums and/or future TCAdmin releases, the last *beta* phase I was in was MVC. I've personally been here long enough to actually see the TCAdmin logo show on the documentation website, instead of the default MediaWiki logo crying out to be replaced. There is a large community here and has been for years but sometimes I guess we (or at least I) feel neglected.

Just going to throw this out there, is it maybe time for a cleanup of the forums? There are users here that seem to just be spam and accounts that have not been used in over 10 years. Maybe time to remove them and clean them up, especially with the introduction of `Reputation` and the fact that i'm not interested in seeing 40 odd birthdays on the sidebar of the forums when the accounts will not be active.

 

I second what Dennis said too. That thread should not have been removed if you did not like the result of what was posted. The forums should be a place to share our opinions on certain topics. May I quote rule 4:

Quote

4. The flaming of another users post is not acceptable. In fairness, all users are allowed to express their opinion or ask questions. We do not believe they should be ridiculed because of it. Please refrain from flaming other users.

And yes, asking the community for donations to something we already pay for should of been discussed, Yes, we do only pay for the license to for TCAdmin, but shouldn't the ability to easily download and share game configurations a given? 

[Dennis]

1 hour ago, alexr03 said:

There is a large community here and has been for years but sometimes I guess we (or at least I) feel neglected.

Exactly. Not to mention that I was actually hired for the most recent job posting back in February 2019. Alongside helping with creating configs and generally helping users on the forum, I was also going to help migrate the forum and get everything up and running (which was supposed to happen around September/October), but I never heard anything back. I used a lot of time reading and testing migration from vBulletin 3.8 to XenForo (as this was the software that most users wanted, and I have a license that isn't used for anything else), so I was quite surprised to see that, all of a sudden, everything had been changed with no apparent interest in the topic that started the entire discussion about a new forum:

 

No offense to anyone, but it feels weird that someone with 20 posts (at that time) and years of inactivity gets to control a forum, just because he provided a license for it. There are multiple active users that I would have suggested for this job, like @alexr03 or @numpty. These people have been showing massive interest in the forums for years, and so have I.

While I do appreciate the modern design of the forum, I felt happier about the old forum. I like changes a lot, but this just feels like a weird place now.

[ucjohn]

4 hours ago, DennisMidjord said:

Exactly. Not to mention that I was actually hired for the most recent job posting back in February 2019. Alongside helping with creating configs and generally helping users on the forum, I was also going to help migrate the forum and get everything up and running (which was supposed to happen around September/October), but I never heard anything back. I used a lot of time reading and testing migration from vBulletin 3.8 to XenForo (as this was the software that most users wanted, and I have a license that isn't used for anything else), so I was quite surprised to see that, all of a sudden, everything had been changed with no apparent interest in the topic that started the entire discussion about a new forum:

 

No offense to anyone, but it feels weird that someone with 20 posts (at that time) and years of inactivity gets to control a forum, just because he provided a license for it. There are multiple active users that I would have suggested for this job, like @alexr03 or @numpty. These people have been showing massive interest in the forums for years, and so have I.

While I do appreciate the modern design of the forum, I felt happier about the old forum. I like changes a lot, but this just feels like a weird place now.

@LFA was the one who I've contacted about this it was his decision and I'm just helping the community, there is nothing wrong with someone assisting a very busy guy. Just cause I'm not active on the forums doesn't mean I wasn't active in behind inside the billing area talking via support ticket, I've been talking with Luis and the previous owner since around 2014 about helping, and upgrading the forums. It went on and off for years but with 2020 here now it was time to upgrade and move into the future. 

About the donation post, yes I removed it cause I had found a solution there was no need for you to get upset over one single post being removed. For this I'm sorry.

We are only making changes to better help the people whom use the forums, if you want to see something implemented then by all means ask for it. The download section there is nothing to test, you apply to join the club you get accepted then you can upload new files into the download section, it's to make sure files are verified that they work instead of someone just making a new post in the forums and uploading it and it breaking something inside TCadmin. It's just a "Install and theme" kinda forums it's not as off putting as Xenforo as that post to use that forum system was years ago. I have a Xenforo key that's paid for and not being used either, but that's neither here nor there.  I'll make a sub section in the Forums with Website "Issues & Requests" and this will allow people to request and vote on new features. Once it's approved by the community then we will make them? 

 

Lifted the limitation @DennisMidjord you may now attach files to forum posts like you used to be able too. 

 

 

Regards,

John

[LFA]

We talked about the download section with John privately. I approved it but there was a failure in communication about blocking config uploads in other sections.

I agree there is some useless info showing up that should be removed. At first when I logged in I didn't know what to do or where to go but I got used to it.

About the spam accounts, I was going to delete them but freaked out when it was going to delete thousands of unverified users and decided to make a db backup before doing this. Then life got in the way and I forgot to do it.

I agree that we should slow down and discuss any big changes in the forum before they are implemented.

[ucjohn]

I have removed some of the useless clutter on the sidebar of the forums and kept relevant blocks there.

[Dennis]

55 minutes ago, ucjohn said:

there is nothing wrong with someone assisting a very busy guy.

No, there isn't. It's just comes down to very poor communication. Suddenly everything is changed, without a word other than "Thank you" from Luis.

 

59 minutes ago, ucjohn said:

About the donation post, yes I removed it cause I had found a solution there was no need for you to get upset over one single post being removed. For this I'm sorry.

I'm not upset about it. I just discussed the case with another person, and suddenly the entire thread was gone. It looked like bad damage control (obviosly only if you saw the thread). Generally, threads shouldn't be deleted, they should be locked, and preferably with a message from a moderator about why it's being closed. Something along: "We've found another solution for this, which is why we're locking the thread for further replies now". Simply deleting it leaves a lot of questions.

1 hour ago, ucjohn said:

The download section there is nothing to test, you apply to join the club you get accepted then you can upload new files into the download section, it's to make sure files are verified that they work instead of someone just making a new post in the forums and uploading it and it breaking something inside TCadmin

This will limit how many people are goint to contribute their work (which is already very limited). I'd say submissions should be open to anyone, but let every submission be moderated. That's the only way to make sure everything will work. That way, you can also control the content that is uploaded.

 

1 hour ago, ucjohn said:

It's just a "Install and theme" kinda forums it's not as off putting as Xenforo as that post to use that forum system was years ago

Care to elaborate? Didn't quite understand that.

 

1 hour ago, ucjohn said:

I'll make a sub section in the Forums with Website "Issues & Requests" and this will allow people to request and vote on new features. Once it's approved by the community then we will make them? 

Sounds like a much better idea!

[ucjohn]

3 minutes ago, DennisMidjord said:

I'm not upset about it. I just discussed the case with another person, and suddenly the entire thread was gone. It looked like bad damage control (obviosly only if you saw the thread). Generally, threads shouldn't be deleted, they should be locked, and preferably with a message from a moderator about why it's being closed. Something along: "We've found another solution for this, which is why we're locking the thread for further replies now". Simply deleting it leaves a lot of questions.

This will limit how many people are goint to contribute their work (which is already very limited). I'd say submissions should be open to anyone, but let every submission be moderated. That's the only way to make sure everything will work. That way, you can also control the content that is uploaded.

1. My bad was just a duh thing on my end, after being up for far to many hours apparently delete was just easier then hiding it.

2. I agree with this idea that member group can submit a file, once verified and validated then it'll appear in download section.

The club idea was more for Developers to have a private area.

 

Xenforo to alot of people there admin ACP is very confusing, Invision Power boards makes it very easy for owners, admins to move about streamline and easily.

I hope together we can work on this community, I'm here to help keep it alive and going strong. I have removed the limitations to uploading content in forum posts. The download system will be sorted soon just replacing a screen on a cell phone atm..

[Dennis]

2 minutes ago, ucjohn said:

Xenforo to alot of people there admin ACP is very confusing, Invision Power boards makes it very easy for owners, admins to move about streamline and easily.

It's all a matter of taste. Some swear to Android, others to iPhone. The crazy ones run Windows Phone.

Some like XenForo, others like Invision. I think it's a matter of what you're used to.

 

I don't think dividing users into private groups will do much good. I can see a few scenarios where it would be a neat feature, but not when trying to make the forums be much more active than they were before. I still think everyone should be allowed to submit configs/themes like before. Not a lot of content were submitted before, and we're potentially missing really cool configs/themes.

[LFA]

If we allow everyone to upload configs to the downloads section is there a way to flag them as verified/unverified working or maybe add thumbs up?

Maybe we could let everyone decide if it works or not instead of a mod having to do it. Some game servers can't be downloaded for free to test that it's working. For example: 

 

[Dennis]

The configs wouldn't show up for download before they're verified, @LFA

[LFA]

@ucjohn Is it possible to have mod group that is allowed to moderate only the downloads?

[ucjohn]

23 minutes ago, LFA said:

@ucjohn Is it possible to have mod group that is allowed to moderate only the downloads?

Yes there is we just have to appoint people to verify them.

[Dennis]

It wouldn't require many people. It's really limited how many configs would be going through the system. I don't think more than one is needed right now - and beside that, moderators would also help out

[ucjohn]

12 minutes ago, DennisMidjord said:

It wouldn't require many people. It's really limited how many configs would be going through the system. I don't think more than one is needed right now - and beside that, moderators would also help out

We would like a designated "File Approver" to handle these tasks outside of moderating forums, someone who can give the Yes or the No to files if you check the staff directory it's very thin lol..

[Dennis]

All I'm saying is, we're not seeing lots of action on the config/themes side It would be less than a config a week.

[ucjohn]

7 minutes ago, DennisMidjord said:

All I'm saying is, we're not seeing lots of action on the config/themes side It would be less than a config a week.

We are working on a solution that'll benefit everyone  that should hopefully increase and give incentives.

[smay3411]

It would be nice to see more configs.

I am teaching myself at the moment have got dayz mod, epoch, overpoch all configs install delete ok with bec install and that was from making my own configs.

I know thw game is old now but I still like playing around with the servers since my old Ausarma dayz.

love the new forum by the way.

cheers

Reema

 

[CloudNine]

Change isn't always good, but it's inevitable. 

[ucjohn]

8 minutes ago, CloudNine said:

Change isn't always good, but it's inevitable. 

But it was due to be freshened up. 

[Bubka3]

Just saw this topic. As I mentioned in the other thread -- seeing the forums change like this has definitely been a shock. So much so that I thought ownership changed for a second.

[ucjohn]

1 hour ago, Bubka3 said:

Just saw this topic. As I mentioned in the other thread -- seeing the forums change like this has definitely been a shock. So much so that I thought ownership changed for a second.

lol yeah that would have been a surprise but I'm sure if that time ever came that Luis would make an official post.

[mouseymars]

I have to be honest I'm not a fan of the 2 themes available on here.

 

Any way to use the old one?

 

 

It's nice to see the forums being worked on, though it would have been better to leave what was there, fix them up separately then turn on the new look.

Edited February 28, 2020 by mouseymars

[Dennis]

There's no way since it's a different software now.

I like the default theme of IPS as it's much more clean than the current one.

[mouseymars]

1 minute ago, DennisMidjord said:

There's no way since it's a different software now.

I like the default theme of IPS as it's much more clean than the current one.

Yeah, I've been using the default it's a lot better.

 

I really wish this had of been discussed more with the community before jumping into it.

Even just asking us what we would like from the froums would have been welcomed.